my 86 fiero
Printed From: West Coast Fieros
Category: Buy / Sell
Forum Name: Engines / Transmissions and Related Parts
Forum Description: Please use FS: (for sale) WTD: (wanted) in the title of each post
URL: http://www.westcoastfieros.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1241
Printed Date: 25 November 2024 at 2:55am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: my 86 fiero
Posted By: garrym
Subject: my 86 fiero
Date Posted: 06 April 2009 at 7:32pm
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hey guys i need to know if a 88 2.8 v6 is the same as the 86 2.8 v6? im hopeing i can just bolt it right in and away it should go? anyone have any suggestions, or problems that might set me on a goose chase? let me know thanks guys:) |
Replies:
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 06 April 2009 at 7:45pm
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Yes and No, yes you can use an 88 motor, its actually a better engine than the 86. However here are the differences. 88 is internally balanced so you MUST use the flywheel/flex plate from the 88 motor. If you put your 86 one on it will destroy the motor. 88 has slightly different sensors, so you will need to use your 86 sensors. I can't remember all the ones that are different, but I know for use the Oil pressure sender is different. Exhaust down pipe is totally different so you must use the exhaust Y pipe from your 86. The 88 ECM is different, however your 86 one will run it just fine. Injectors are usually better in the 88's, and are plug and play with the 86 harness so no need to worry there. I think that about covers the odd changes. I bought an 85 Fiero that had an 88 motor installed in it, everything ran fine. I own an 88GT and an 85Gt and an 87GT which I routinely swap parts around. ------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 06 April 2009 at 8:11pm
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wow thats a good thing to know, thank you. i will have to check to make sure i have the 88 flywheel/flex plate from the 88 motor, im not sure but looking online, the 88 flywheel kit is for the 5 speed std. i have a 4 speed std. seems like the 85,86,87 kit is all the same and the 88 doesnt have a 4 speed flywheel kit. but im thinking that it should be fine? again correct me if im wrong, i might need to find a 88 flywheel kit, and with sensors. they are pretty strait forward to change, haha im very mechaically inclined. but it will just take a lil time to get it right i made a mistake on this one clutch kits are the same, flywheel different. i might need one of those |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 06 April 2009 at 8:29pm
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The 4spd and 5spd flywheel for any given year is the same. So you can use an 88 5spd flywheel on your 4spd without any issue. I believe there is also a 4cly Sunfire flywheel than can be used on the 88 V6 motors as well. I am sorry I don't have the interchange info handy. I think Dr. Fiero has the part numbers so hopefully he replies to this thread.
------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 06 April 2009 at 8:46pm
| i hope so as well, i might need alot of advice on this but its my project and i really really want to get this going :) thank you |
Posted By: Dr.Fiero
Date Posted: 07 April 2009 at 8:00am
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Yeah, just hit the wreckers and get a flywheel off a ~2000 sunfire (or whatever) with the (2.2L?). |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 15 April 2009 at 9:34pm
| just thought i would ask, but im sure i can. use my 86 starter on a 88? i looked at parts the part number is the same, i assume it would work maybe im wrong? if not anyone have a 88 v6 starter? i have cash:) |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 15 April 2009 at 9:47pm
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Yep starters are one of those odd items, all Fiero's 4cyl 84 right up to 88V6 had the same starter. Only diffrence was the 4 had a tail bracket that you had to use. ------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 21 April 2009 at 6:16pm
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well, here is my situation, i have the old engine somewhat almost ready to pull out. as i am now deeply depressed that my car might not live as long as i wanted it too. let me say one tragic word. RUST!!!! and lots of it. i was pulling off the wheel well splash guard thingies. tons of dirt fell to the ground and the red/orange glow started. the main frame is ok but where the battery sits gone right threw as well as both sides of the bottom of the rear trunk. the whole corners towards the front are completely gone. any way to fix this? as find another frame cut out the corners i need and weld them into my car that i cut out the same size. too bad capt fiero didnt hang on to that frame. now i need it. the next thing i could do is buy another car and take this one as parts car for myself. but as for the engine swap its still a go and i will drive around this rusted out one for a while. gee wiz the more i look the more problems arrise. the only good news is i found the shorts. its 2 fuses that are tail lights and another that says wdo or something similer |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 21 April 2009 at 6:54pm
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In todays day and age trying to find a clean rust free frame is next to impossible unless you find someone like myself that has owned the car since near new and took care to not let rust take hold on the car. Most any "cheap" car is going to be hard, wait, wait wait a min. Go to craigslist as quickly as you can, find an 87SE for sale in Chilliwack. Its $550 I know the history on the car and it even won some shows locally, however in the last 3 years it has passed hands several times and been sold for less and less each time. The person that took care of it, actully did take good care of it. Its a black 87SE V6 Auto car. Chin Spoiler, Tinted front markers, nice paint, or at least it use to be nice. To my knowledge the engine is blown and the brakes are shot, but if you have all the donar parts at your disposal to fix it up, you might come out really ahead of the game.
Here are pics from back in the day, Mizers 87SE in Chilliwack
------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 21 April 2009 at 6:58pm
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I don't know why some of the thumbnails are not loading, just click on one that works and scroll through the gallery all the main pics should work. Last I heard fender vents had been installed in the front fenders with freshly painted black fenders. ------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 21 April 2009 at 7:27pm
| THANKS, oh how hard would it be to make it a standard? and its a se, how hard would it be to make a gt? just swap over the gt parts? or whats the difference? i wouldnt mind finding another 86-87 gt ? who knows. |
Posted By: Dr.Fiero
Date Posted: 21 April 2009 at 8:44pm
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From a 'whats the car worth' standpoint.... and this is PURELY FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES.... I can't condone it, or recommend it (cough).... you would be best to 'keep your GT', and have the VIN tags somehow move over to his SE chassis. There is NO difference from car to car. It's just that a GT is worth like 3-4X what an SE is in the event of a loss. A few people have already learned this the hard way. |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 22 April 2009 at 7:02am
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Maybe I should make a new topic for this, but for now, I'll put it in here. This is a very nice 86SE
This is an 85GT
Both cars are 90% identical from the factory, same body, same ground skirts, same nose, rear bumper and hood and deck lid are the same. Same headlights, only real difference is the speakers were in the seats on 85 cars and in 86+ they moved them to the B pillars. Same 4spd's you get the picture. In ICBC's eyes the 85GT is worth 2-3 times as much as the 86SE simply because the 85 was a GT. When I was in my fender bender in my 85GT a few years ago, they valued my 400,000km 85GT with at that time a stock V6 and stock suspension at $5000, and even cut me a cheque for $2500 for repair costs. (I had them pay the claim out to me for the repairs - at my cost the repairs were only $250, their estimate was $3000 for repairs) Thats one of the "coughkeptmyvinplatescoughcoughwithregypaperswcough" reasons that I'll part out an SE due to much less damage than I would part out any GT. With the value of our cars rising every year even ICBC is paying out bigger and bigger numbers for Fiero's. Always keep all your receipts for everything you do. |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 25 April 2009 at 5:33pm
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hey guys, so i have almost got my engine out. the last 2 cradle bolts wont come out and tonight i have to pick up some long sockets for my impact wrench from princess auto, i have the ones from the rear but the ones that are a hinge are on there good, i have to remove the nuts on them instead of the bolt, i think this would be easiest. anyone have any suggestions it would help, also i noticed the brake fluid cable from the front connects to the engine via a large cilinder thing, the 88 engine doesnt have this, i will be swapping it over. any suggestions yet? |
Posted By: Patrick
Date Posted: 25 April 2009 at 5:49pm
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Make sure you spray down rusted bolts/nuts with plenty of PB Blaster and let it soak in overnight at least.
??? Are you referring to the clutch slave cylinder on the transmission?
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garrym wrote:Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 25 April 2009 at 11:50pm
| could be, not sure what it was. but i know it had to come off, its on the side that the trans is on, although its under a heat sheild and i dont know where it goes too. it is a clear fluid. it seems more like clutch fluid now that i think about it. |
Posted By: Patrick
Date Posted: 26 April 2009 at 10:10am
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Clutch fluid, brake fluid... same stuff. If you've got a hydraulic line going to the engine/transmission, there's only one place for it to go... the clutch slave cylinder.
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Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 26 April 2009 at 11:17am
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I think all the mechanics just read your post about "brake hooking to a cylinder thing on the engine, just shook their collective heads and walked away" There is no connection for your brakes hydraulic lines to the engine. Only line from the car to the engine that has brake fluid in it is for the clutch hydraulics. If you honestly don't know the difference between a clutch hydraulic line and a brake hydraulic line. Then a lot of us are really scared that you may never get this job completed. I'll try to answer questions for you as you go, but you might want to start taking pics as you go. If not for reference for posting, but so that YOU can look at them when it is time to put things back together. I at one time was where you are now, when it comes to knowledge about cars. However thinking back, there is no way I would have been able to do an engine swap, I had trouble just trying to remove and re-install a dist shaft. Granted this group did not exist back then and digital cameras were almost non existent. Just take your time and DO NOT cut something because you don't know or think it is needed. I'll put this thread as subscribed to my cell phone email, so if you are in a panic, I'll try to reply as soon as possible. On tip on the front cradle bolts. Put a hydraulic jack under the front cradle cross member, you are not going to lift the car, but you want to take the weight off of the bolts in the hinges in order to slide them out. You may need to use assorted hammers, pick forks,wedges and chisel's to get them to come loose.
Just take it slow, take lots of pics, try not to break anything including yourself. ------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 26 April 2009 at 2:04pm
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haha, yea i have never changed a engine, my friend has, but you never know what some ppl do to these cars, the engine that is in it has all sorts of bolts missing and what not all over it. heat sheilds and such as well are missing. and with the brake fluid just a mind blank, im really good at taking things apart and puting them back together :) soon i will have this out. and i wont break anything i promise:) not myself anyways |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 26 April 2009 at 3:52pm
| got the nuts of of them finally, used the air chisel and well, its now has some small cuts into it. ill replace them and whats with the bolts being a 18mm its a rare bolt to begin with, let alone 23 years of rust. time to replace some of these bolts anyways so its easier to get off next time i want to pull them apart. and funny enough i do not have a digital camera. but i can remember alot of things. its going to be easy when its time to reinstall the cradle into the car again and hook things up :) i didn't cut one wire and the new engine has the whole harness up to the computer and what not so i am excited |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 26 April 2009 at 4:48pm
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If you don't already know what "Copper Coat" anti size compound is, go to your parts store NOW and buy some. I have a 6 or 8oz jar of it, and have been using that same jar for nearly 3 years. I put it on EVERYTHING that goes together. My cradle bolts once you release the initial torque load on them, can be removed with your fingers. Same goes for control arm bushings, brake caliper bolts and other related parts. I even put the stuff on the long screws that hold the tail lights in place. Its a paste like stuff, kinda goes on like nail polish, comes with a brush. Remember the old rubber cement jars from school. (don't know if they still have them) But there is a brush attached to the inside of the cap, you brush it on and it simply stays put, never dries out, and works wonders. Never having another rusty bolt makes it all worth it for me when I have to take it apart in 6 months because of one to many clutch dumps, high speed pot holes or other related abusive causes. ------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 26 April 2009 at 5:11pm
| i willl buy some. does anyone know where i can buy some new cradle nuts? the ones for the 18mm hinge ones? i have the cradle out already but im calling it quits for a few days as im working night shifts and its hard to sleep when its sunny :) |
Posted By: Patrick
Date Posted: 26 April 2009 at 9:38pm
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You didn't soak 'em down overnight with PB Blaster before removing them, did you?
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Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 27 April 2009 at 8:54am
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Alder Auto has a great selection of Metric bolts. They have a store in Port Kells on 96 and I belive another location in Aldergrove on Fraser Hwy. If you totally get stuck, I am sure I have a few of the cradle bolts and nuts herei n my bolt bucket. ------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 27 April 2009 at 9:28am
| i soked them down with liquid wrench for about a week and tried using air guns, pry bars and wrenches hammers and wrenches. so i used the air chisel and although there in ok shape i put some cuts in them with it so i want new bolts, maybe a diff size than 18mm since its hard to find sockets for them |
Posted By: Patrick
Date Posted: 27 April 2009 at 9:50am
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I'm glad to hear that you at least tried some kind of penetrating fluid (although a lot of people swear by PB Blaster and nothing else), but it's possible because of the extensive rust you found that I suppose your cradle bolts and nuts were really stuck badly on there. Anyway, you got 'em off. That was the biggest challenge!
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Posted By: garrym
Date Posted: 01 May 2009 at 10:30am
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so an update, yesterday i managed to get the old engine off the cradle me and my friend took all the bolts and heat sheilds and what nots off in order to get to the engine bolts, without a hoist but a lot of balls we used a 2x6 and a tie down strap and wrapped it around the 2x6. picked the engine up my friend on one side me on the other, man that thing is heavy! most important thing to know always keep your work space clear because i tripped on my tool box and luckly i was able to catch myself although the engine started swinging and i lost my balance because of the mass weight and i completly was pulled over. good thing i let it down as gently as possible. for sure im renting a hoist for the day when i put it back together it was so funny. good news my clutch is pretty new! but i noticed im missing some of the bolts on the engine im pulling out. the more i discover the more i think i was sold a dud. although this new engine will be a saviour. the exaust manifold on both sides the heads of the bolts were broken off some just sheared off and nuts were put on the ones left. im so surprised i got the thing even running, not even grounded properly and what not. but all is good. im going to vegas in 2 weeks but next weekend i hope to have it at least on the cradle and in the car. does anyone know anything about the rear breaks i know i talked to you capt about it, i think you said trans am calipers and roters were cheeper or something ? but then no ebrake? or anyone know where to get cheep brake pads my calipers are in good shape still, and the disks are alright but wouldnt mind new ones, maybe use trans am ones with fiero calipers? or something similer? |