Hi all,

Recently posted on PCA as Rich is trying to get an idea of who will be attending, thread is here below, if anyone has questions let me know.

http://forum.pca-cwr.org/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3245&start=0 - http://forum.pca-cwr.org/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3245&s tart=0

Yeah, all you guys who thought you were so fast on the final leg of the trip home from Whistler... let's see how good you guys are on a track.

Or are you all (except for Brian) pussies?

I'm going to be driving my duke powered '84. It'll only cost you 40 bucks to beat my time and rub my face in it.

Come on all you wannabee road racer sissies, show me what you can do!

Some club dude wrote: Ah don't worry Patrick you would not have liked it.  As we were speeding and driving too fast.

Bassman wrote: ...we should do a quick tech day, brake line flush?

Count me in for that!  

For any that may be interested, we will be meeting at the McDonalds on Harris Road & Lougheed Highway in Pitt Meadows at 7:30am.

Gates are usually open by 7:30am, to arrive at 8am, park, unpack and settle in, have tech done on your car, register then walk the course...leads to a 9am drivers meeting and the race is on

If anyone has any questions, let me know

Bassman wrote: If anyone has any questions...

Yeah, I want to know who else has the cajones to come to the track this Sunday.

Romeo wrote: I think I'll leave Gretchin at home, but I'll be there.

You can co-drive, Pat saw this when he was out last, maybe you both tag up?...suggestion

Romeo wrote: I think I'll leave Gretchin at home, but I'll be there.

What happened to Gretchin? Last Thursday you said you'd be racing her.

Geez, do all the women in your life walk all over you?

Aw, come on guys (and gals)! How many Fieros in this club and we're only going to be seeing THREE (Brian, Colby, myself) showcasing our cars at the autocross this Sunday??!!!

40 bucks for a full day of fun. 40 bucks!

Come on, I don't want to be the only newb out there knocking traffic cones all over the place!

Bassman wrote: Oh Newb's are fun to pick on...lol

Which is exactly why I'm hoping there'll be more of us to help spread out the abuse.

Let's go guys, come out and kick some Porsche/BMW/Corvette butt! You know you want to.

My greatest fear is that half-way through the course I'll get confused as to which way I'm supposed to be going through the cones (and end up going over them)!

Cheese wrote: Then depending on how you feel you can drive it slowly until you're comfortable or do what I did on my first run ever and drive it much too fast and spin out.

Knowing what I'm like (despite what some club members may think), I'll probably be going way too fast and end up sending a few traffic cones into orbit.  

Cheese wrote: You can always ask someone to ride with you and direct you around the course too.

That might end up being Tristan's job. Gawd help us!

Patrick wrote: My greatest fear is that half-way through the course I'll get confused as to which way I'm supposed to be going through the cones (and end up going over them)!

You will have available MANY that can co-drive and be your navigator...and this is why we meet for breakfast and get all settled in early, so we can walk you through the course as many times as required...most clubs have a Novice walk through with an instructor, between the group of us, we will help you through so you can enjoy

I would suggest on YouTube to watch as many autocross video's, and view of few of these sites:

http://www.eurotuner.com/howto/38238/index.html - http://www.eurotuner.com/howto/38238/index.html

http://www.gglotus.org/ggtech/autoxtips/autoxtips.htm - http://www.gglotus.org/ggtech/autoxtips/autoxtips.htm

This site all should read, funny but good: http://www.sfaroc.com/archives/id9.html - http://www.sfaroc.com/archives/id9.html

Thanks Brian!

I better get out of here and go buy that groovy blue brake fluid.

For those who may want to come out for a visit:

http://%3ciframe%20width=%22425%22%20height=%22350%22%20frameborder=%220%22%20scrolling=%22no%22%20marginheight=%220%22%20marginwidth=%220%22%20src=%22http//maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=18494+Ford+Road,+Pitt+Meadows+BC&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=50.823846,82.265625&ie=UTF8&om=1&hq=&hnear=18494+Ford+Rd,+Pitt+Meadows,+Greater+Vancouver+Regional+District,+British+Columbia,+Canada&z=16&ll=49.22249,-122.709056&output=embed">
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=18494+Ford+Road,+Pitt+Meadows+BC&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=50.823846,82.265625&ie=UTF8&om=1&hq=&hnear=18494+Ford+Rd,+Pitt+Meadows,+Greater+Vancouver+Regional+District,+British+Columbia,+Canada&z=16&ll=49.22249,-122.709056&source=embed" style="color:#0000FF;text-align:left - View Larger Map '>Location: BC Driving Centre, Pitt Meadows

How do I get there?



Rules at BCDC:
- Drive the speed limit to and from the event. Obey all signs.
- Exhaust noise maximum 92 db (Zero tolerance)
- NO!-Speeding, burn-outs, loud stereos or excessive noise.
- Respect the local residents. It is a privilege to be here, and we are guests. Act accordingly.
- You must Keep your car under control at all times.
- Do not lock up your brakes.
- No doughnuts or continual tire smoke.
- No exhibition driving.

Hope to see a few, otherwise enjoy your weekend all

Bassman wrote: ... Obey all signs.

My favorite sign within the grounds is the one at the "intersection" near the entrance which says, Watch for low flying aircraft.

Going to bed now. Big day tomorrow.

Brian, I've sent you a PM in regards to meeting and driving out to Pitt Meadows together.

This is certainly the earliest I've been up out of bed on a Sunday morning for awhile!

Almost like waking up for that first tee off time, nice morning mist, dew on the greens, etc...

Ok I am uploading the raw videos now.  If someone wants to download them, convert them and play with them feel free.  These are currently .mov files, 640x480 30fps.   Frankly they are pretty poor quality, but for those that were driving, I am sure they would want copy's of their cars on the track. 

I started the upload at 9pm, and won't be done till probably 10pm or 11pm Sunday night.  I am only posting the link early as I am heading to bed, so won't be around to let everyone know when they are done.  If you are reading this at 1am its a safe bet you can download them.   There is a total of 7 video's one of the videos is a double length as it has both Tristens and Patrick's run.  All the others are single length videos. 

It was really fun watching and even more fun taking a spin with Brian in his car.  Thanks to Colby for loaning me a helmet for the run.   I think Patrick and Tristan are now both addicts to the racing as well.

Have a good night all.

Dir is here, http://captfiero.com/videos/fieroautocross/autocross09052010 - http://captfiero.com/videos/fieroautocross/autocross09052010

BLAZE OF GLORY!!!

Hehe, that was beyond fun! Still all pumped up and hyper from it.

As of 10:19pm Colby1, Patrick2, Brian2 and Brian and David are done.

Colby2 will be done at NOW, its complete.

Tristen2 will be done at Now its Complete

PatrickandTrsten will be done at 11:08

I would love to see all the Fiero guys times posted.  From what I saw it was a good representation of what different models with different mods can do.

Brian's being a 3.2 V6 has a fair bit more torque to come out of a tight corner and regain his speed quickly.

Tristan's being a 2.8 4spd with the same gearing as Brian was albeit slower, however had normal street tires on the rear with almost zero suspension mods and no experience with trying to navigate cones, (which is one of the Things Brian is Great at and I think I would be fairly horrible at)  Tristan was still able to get some times in the high 50's.

Colby's and Patrick's cars, are very similarly setup cars with similar wheels and tires and similar engines, both 2.5 Dukes with 5spds.  I will almost bet that one difference is if you took the 2 cars across the scales, Patrick's car would weight in a bit less than Colby's due to lower amount of options and add in items.  IIRC Colby's car had a few power options that Patrick's didn't.   The 4cly itself just does not have the torque needed to quickly regain speed after exiting a corner. So it is at a bit of disadvantage in that aspect.  However many will also argue that the 4cyl being lighter does make it a more nimble car to do drive.

I would love to see a list from each of the 4 drivers, listing there car

Engine and Mods to Engine

Trans 4spd Muncie, 5spd, (Isuzu or Getrag) or Auto.

Modifications IE chopped springs, front or rear bar mods

Bushings stock or rubber

Tires and Wheels, Sizes both aspect, width and if you know your tread wear off hand.

Regardless of everything I think you all KICKED A$S.  Congrats Today to each and everyone of you.

As of 10:52 all except the double lenght PatricandTristen video are done.  The final video should be complete at 11:05  Then you guys can have at it. 

if anyone wants me to compress them down to 1/2 or 1/4 there current file size I will do it.  Otherwise I may let the video owners play with it rather than me make changes they don't want to have.

THE MIGHTY DUKE !!!

That was a blast!

Woo hoo, that was fun. The only drawback was that there were so many cars out today that it reduced the number of runs we each had on the track. At the event I watched a month ago, everyone got eight runs in. Today that was reduced to five.

I gotta say that I was really impressed with how my duke powered '84 felt out there on the track. Sure, with horsepower limited to what, 90(?), the ol' 4-banger sure as heck wasn't going to be rapidly accelerating out of the corners, but at no time did I ever feel like I was totally losing control of the car. And no, I wasn't driving like an old lady.  It's quite a rush to be drifting around a corner sliding sideways and knowing that the car still has to be guided through a relatively narrow  "gate" at the end of the turn. It made for some creative steering!

I was pleased that I only hit one pylon (that I'm aware of) all day, unlike at least one unnamed club member who... ahem, dragged a pylon under his car for the entire circuit on his last run at the very end of the day.  Heh heh. Over the whole day however, there were plenty of other abused pylons out there. [EDIT] I just remembered that a pylon getting stuck under a Fiero happened at least twice today. I guess it can happen to anybody!

My first run was really embarrassing as I got totally confused out on the track and didn't know where the heck I was supposed to be going. Brian came along as a passenger on my second run and made sure I didn't zig when I was supposed to zag.

On my fourth (second to last) run, Colby came along as my passenger to see if he could offer some advice as I seemed to be stuck at 62 seconds. We had a good chat after that run and Colby made a few helpful suggestions. His advice must've been great, as on my next run, my last one of the day, I shaved two seconds off and basically tied Colby's best time of one minute flat.

Cheese wrote: I was noticing though, Patrick seemed to have less trouble with controlling his car than I did. Though I don't think he was pushing it as hard as me, judging by our best times I'd say he was able to go at least as fast as me around the corners...

We both have 4-cylinder 5-speeds, so power wise we should more or less be even. The biggest difference in our cars IMO is the stiffness of the suspension. We've both cut our springs, but I was a little more drastic in the number of coils that I removed. My factory ‘84 springs were probably a bit longer than your ‘86 springs (which is why the 84's normally sit so high), so with Clynt's advice and help, I cut a full two coils off both the front and back. My front end especially is very stiff. I gotta tell ya though, the car felt great in the corners! The tires were squealing, but the handling felt... predictable. There were no ugly surprises. My rear end never once tried to pass me.

I haven't watched any of the videos yet, so I'll probably be up half the night reviewing them now. Gotta prepare for the next event ya know!

It was great to see Dave and Lisa and Red Willey come out to watch as well.  

I think Brian, Colby, Tristan and myself all acquitted ourselves quite well showcasing our favorite little plastic car at the autocross today. We done the Fiero proud!

Capt Fiero wrote: I would love to see a list from each of the 4 drivers, listing there car Engine and Mods to Engine Trans 4spd Muncie, 5spd, (Isuzu or Getrag) or Auto. Modifications IE chopped springs, front or rear bar mods Bushings stock or rubber Tires and Wheels, Sizes both aspect, width and if you know your tread wear off hand.

Stock '84 duke 4-banger with a gutted cat and dual-exhaust from a GT

Isuzu 5-speed (originally a 4-speed Muncie)

Cut two full coils from both front and rear springs

http://www.monroe.com/products/sensatrac_default.asp - Monroe Sensa-Trac struts and shocks

Factory rubber bushings everywhere (I haven't changed them.)

http://www.acu-tru.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=45_531 - Sunfire 16" alloy rims

http://www.1010tires.com/tire.asp?tirebrand=Hankook&tiremodel=Ventus+HRII+H405 - Hankook Ventus HRII tires . Usually run at 36 psi. Fronts - 205/55R16 ... Rears - 225/50R16

And 38 years of driving experience.

* Should also add that a wheel alignment hasn't been done yet since I cut the springs!

Should also be noted that I have -10 degrees of camber on my rear left, and -7 degrees on my rear right (And no, I don't mean those as decimals), 10 degrees of toe out on the front, 7 degrees of cross-caster favouring the left and the tie rods are unevenly spun, meaning my wheel sits twisted about 30 degrees to the right when tracking straight. Still have yet to install my rear sway-bar. And as for shocks, my left just finished dying the rest of the way on the way back to camping here.

Yeah, I'm pretty much a racecar.

Hey all,

I am very proud to see some activity regarding the racing events, and to have all of us out there was great...need Austin and a few others geared up for next season

The discussions above highlight a few things:

- how we evaluate our cars now in a different perspective as we are actually driving in a controlled performance perspective

- as individuals can evaluate, learn and improve our driving ability (Yes even you Tris

- bring us together more as a active car club...actually using our cars as advertised over 20+ years ago "Pontiac Performance"...and proving it currently to many

- create another facet to our club, we love to repair and modify our cars that we can have a group more focused and supportive to each other to prepare and compete

It's a real lazy day and breakfast is being served...I'll post a video later.

Cheers to all...was a enjoyable day, even at the pub after with the senior PCA group...I have been invited to ORP (Oregon Raceway Park) for end of October, anyone know where I can rent a truck/trailer?

Cheese wrote: Patrick, it sounds like the major difference between our cars is that you've increased the amount of understeer by stiffening your front end while I've reduced it (possibly too much) by adding a rear sway bar. I think I'll try driving with it removed next time.

I've read a lot about adding sway bars to Fieros at http://www.fiero.nl/cgi-bin/fiero/Ultimate.cgi?action=intro - Pennock's , and from what I can determine, adding a rear sway bar to our 4-bangers is not nearly as helpful as it is adding a rear sway bar to Fieros with larger/heavier engines.

Having said that, if a rear sway bar is added it needs to be less stiff than the front. There are differing opinions on this, but the general consensus is that for more predictable handling, the front sway bar should be thicker. So if a 1" sway bar is added to the back, a 1.25" (or thereabouts) sway bar should be swapped in at the front.

Colby, what are the thicknesses of your sway bars?

Cheese wrote: Patrick wrote: I was pleased that I only hit one pylon (that I'm aware of) all day, unlike at least one unnamed club member who... ahem, dragged a pylon under his car for the entire circuit on his last run at the very end of the day.  Heh heh. Over the whole day however, there were plenty of other abused pylons out there. [EDIT] I just remembered that a pylon getting stuck under a Fiero happened at least twice today. I guess it can happen to anybody! Actually it happened to me twice, so I think it happened three times for all of us.

Did it really? Twice for you? I don't know how I missed that.

Of course, the pylon dragging I originally was thinking of was Tristan's last run where he was going pedal to the metal and wiping out in spectacular fashion.  

As a group, we Fiero guys all did pretty good avoiding pylons. There were some drivers out there however who had quite an appetite for traffic cones.  

Cheese wrote: Romeo wrote: Should also be noted that I have -10 degrees of camber on my rear left, and -7 degrees on my rear right (And no, I don't mean those as decimals)... Have you considered trying to correct the alignment yourself? It sounds like you have nothing to lose since it's so far off.

That's exactly what I said to Tristan last week, but apparently Tristan likes to live life on the edge (of his tires).

Last and fastest run of the day, should be ready on YouTube shortly...just video with lots of wind, camera was on the roof

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiaG4_bN7u8&feature=youtube_gdata - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiaG4_bN7u8&feature=youtu be_gdata

I don't have a lift at the moment with which to correct it. And yes Colby, I had actually bent the frame of Gretchin once upon a time, and after paying to get it pulled, I didn't have enough funds left over to pay for an alignment. So, I've just kind of... Dealt with it. But as Patrick pointed out, I'm literally riding on narrow little slivers of the rear tires, which is not exactly optimal during high G maneuvers.

And Patrick, until my final run, who was the only Fiero driver who hadn't hit a cone? Yeah, thought so.

Bassman wrote: ...video with lots of wind, camera was on the roof

Damn, I want to hear the engine screaming and the tires squealing!

It's too bad that a camera of that type isn't able to run an external mic. That way you could mount the camera wherever you like and then have the mic mounted in a more wind protected area.

Nice clean run though. Gives me something to strive for!

Romeo wrote: And Patrick, until my final run, who was the only Fiero driver who hadn't hit a cone? Yeah, thought so.

And you thoughtfully corrected that aberration in spectacular fashion!

Hey, we all did great. Just think how well we'll all do when we actually have our cars set up properly.

Cheese wrote: If you want to read these pages yourself you can find them http://63.196.113.82/8shark.html - here .

Thanks Colby, I'll certainly read it over. Looks interesting.

Romeo wrote: I don't have a lift at the moment with which to correct it. And yes Colby, I had actually bent the frame of Gretchin once upon a time, and after paying to get it pulled, I didn't have enough funds left over to pay for an alignment. So, I've just kind of... Dealt with it. But as Patrick pointed out, I'm literally riding on narrow little slivers of the rear tires, which is not exactly optimal during high G maneuvers

Ahh, OK. You don't need to pay for an alignment to make it better. You can measure camber with a level or by holding a square to the ground by your wheel to find the difference between the top of the rim and bottom then use some trigonometry. Toe can be measured by carefully setting up some strings (like http://raystrax.com/ha/images/HA_Toe-In.JPG - this ) and measuring the difference between the front and rear of the rim to the string, or by finding the difference in width at the front of two front/rear tires compared to the rear. Once you know how far out you are (well, I guess you do already), a little bit of trial and error with your adjustments can get you fairly close to where you want to be.

Bassman wrote: Very cool reading Pat...

Hey hey, give Colbster the proper credit!

Cheese wrote: Romeo wrote: I don't have a lift at the moment with which to correct it. And yes Colby, I had actually bent the frame of Gretchin once upon a time, and after paying to get it pulled, I didn't have enough funds left over to pay for an alignment. So, I've just kind of... Dealt with it. But as Patrick pointed out, I'm literally riding on narrow little slivers of the rear tires, which is not exactly optimal during high G maneuvers Ahh, OK. You don't need to pay for an alignment to make it better. You can measure camber with a level or by holding a square to the ground by your wheel to find the difference between the top of the rim and bottom then use some trigonometry. Toe can be measured by carefully setting up some strings (like http://raystrax.com/ha/images/HA_Toe-In.JPG - this ) and measuring the difference between the front and rear of the rim to the string, or by finding the difference in width at the front of two front/rear tires compared to the rear. Once you know how far out you are (well, I guess you do already), a little bit of trial and error with your adjustments can get you fairly close to where you want to be.

And Patrick, you cannot deny the sheer entertainment value of that run. I ended it on one hell of a high note. lol

Romeo wrote: And Patrick, you cannot deny the sheer entertainment value of that run. I ended it on one hell of a high note. lol

Yes, you certainly made it worthwhile for me to quickly park my car after my run and literally sprint back to the track so I could see you flying out of control out there!

For those of you who weren't in attendance, Tristan was only two cars behind me in the sequence we had to adhere to all day. Normally there wasn't enough time for me to park after my run and then go watch Tristan bounce and slide around the track.

It was a fun day!

Oh Patrick and Brian, we forgot to tell everyone about the "triple-charger" on that BMW! Remembering that conversation still makes me laugh...

Patrick, Brian and I were gazing into the engine bay of an M Coupe, and we were wondering what this one thing near the fuse box was for... Out of nowhere comes this one kid who had been watching, and he announces it's the air filter. After pointing out the large air filter on the front of the engine, he simply shrugs, looks at me like I'm an idiot, and says "Guess it's the triple-charger then" and wanders off. I was like WHAT THE HELL JUST HAPPENED? lol

Romeo wrote: Out of nowhere comes this one kid who had been watching, and he announces it's the air filter. After pointing out the large air filter on the front of the engine, he simply shrugs, looks at me like I'm an idiot, and says "Guess it's the triple-charger then" and wanders off.

I noticed that kid a few more times over the next hour or so. He was a little odd indeed. I suspect he was from the shallow end of the gene pool.

karnak wrote: I look Forward to seeing you out in the spring!

Gary, I hope you're not going to be a stranger until then. You're more than welcome to attend the Fiero club meetings along with Colby, even if you only drive a Porsche.

Brian as to your truck and trailer.  I'd say drive the car down and rent a U-Haul truck and dolly back "if" the car breaks down.  However that won't do you any good in regards to tire wear.  Unless you quickly found a small trailer and added a hitch to your Fiero, so you could town your race tires and tools down with you.  Other option is to find a buddy with a large truck that does not use it much and then rent a tow dolly from here and run the car on the dolly both ways.    Lisa and I won't be ready for an Oct run, however my plan is to borrow my bosses flat deck car hauler and tow the Fiero behind the Blazer on our next Oregon run in the spring of next year.    By then the 4.9 should be in top running shape with the brig brakes and other bugs worked out.

Gary, that's great to hear!

Oooooo, the times are posted http://members.shaw.ca/rsandor4/Sept%205th%202010%20autox.htm - Here !

I haven't even looked at them yet. Off I go...

Well shucks, considering the course as laid out Sunday was tailored for faster vehicles (honest it was, I'll post an image of the course later), I didn't do too bad for a totally green newb driving a 90 hp commuter car.

The fella just ahead of me who was driving a Nissan Skyline only beat me out by 14/100ths of a second!

Man oh man, I'm ready to go out and kick some ass at the next autocross.

Bassman wrote: Nice, Colby beat the old man...lol...

Hey, who you calling an "old man"?

< Pat toddles off to swig some Geritol > 

LOL!!!

Aw Patty, don't worry, will set you up in a sweet retirement home soon enough.

Cheese wrote: Toe can be measured by carefully setting up some strings and measuring the difference between the front and rear of the rim to the string, or by finding the difference in width at the front of two front/rear tires compared to the rear.

Colby, a question on your string diagram. Is the distance between the front hubs absolutely the same as the distance between the rear hubs on '84-'87 Fieros? I'm just wondering, because if they weren't it would complicate things a bit according to the instructions in the diagram.

Romeo wrote: Aw Patty, don't worry, will set you up in a sweet retirement home soon enough.

In the next room beside Johnny no doubt.

Romeo wrote: Patrick wrote: Romeo wrote: Aw Patty, don't worry, will set you up in a sweet retirement home soon enough. In the next room beside Johnny no doubt. Johnny Boy is barely older than I am, remember?

How many times do we need to remind you that Johnny Boy is somewhat more than 17 years of age?  

Cheese wrote: Patrick wrote: Colby, a question on your string diagram. Is the distance between the front hubs absolutely the same as the distance between the rear hubs on '84-'87 Fieros? I'm just wondering, because if they weren't it would complicate things a bit according to the instructions in the diagram. Unfortunately no, there's a slight difference...

It shouldn't be too difficult to find out what this difference is. With that information, it should be possible to get the toe-in even more precise using this method.

My concern with not taking this difference into account is that the strings along the side of the car won't actually be parallel to each other. Therefore, the toe-in adjustments, which are based on distances measured from these strings, won't be as precise as they could be. Heck, to be more blunt, they're wrong!

Come on Colby, let's get our little 4-bangers set up properly so we can go surprise a few more people!  

Cheese wrote: Patrick wrote: Oooooo, the times are posted http://members.shaw.ca/rsandor4/Sept%205th%202010%20autox.htm - Here ! I haven't even looked at them yet. Off I go... Hey, we did OK! Just wish I had made my goal of getting into the 59's, next time I guess.

Colby, considering the layout of the course (which I'll post once I get my map out of the car), we did great! That course on Sunday was definitely laid out to favour higher horsepower/faster vehicles!

Just a note to take into account with the string method if you are trying to use the rear wheels as reference to the fronts, "if you have different width rear tires you can't do it that way"  I know some of you have wider rear tires than front tires, which will throw the entire project off whack.   I prefer using the tape measure method personally, measuring the center of each front tire at the front of the tire and the rear of the tire.

Another side note, if you have ramps to drive the car onto, it can make this process much faster and easier.  If you don't have ramps and would like to borrow a set, let me know as I have a really good set here.  They are 6 ton truck ramps, so they are pretty safe for a Fiero.

Capt Fiero wrote: Just a note to take into account with the string method if you are trying to use the rear wheels as reference to the fronts, "if you have different width rear tires you can't do it that way"

Keep in mind Dave, that according to that diagram, it's the distances from the rims that are being measured. The tires themselves shouldn't make a difference.

Cheese wrote: Well, what you can do is set up the strings at a known distance from the hubs (I did it from the centre of my rims) on both the left and right sides of the car. The two strings will not be parallel to each other, you need to correct this.

So Colby, did you correct for this when you did your alignment? Did you, did you, did you?

Capt Fiero wrote: However something else I just thought of, people with Grand Am front brakes will have roughly 1/2 inch wider front track than factory cars.

Yep, those are exactly the variables that need to be kept in mind when doing the "string" method of wheel alignment.

Patrick wrote: Cheese wrote: Patrick wrote: Oooooo, the times are posted http://members.shaw.ca/rsandor4/Sept%205th%202010%20autox.htm - Here ! I haven't even looked at them yet. Off I go... Hey, we did OK! Just wish I had made my goal of getting into the 59's, next time I guess. Colby, considering the layout of the course (which I'll post once I get my map out of the car), we did great! That course on Sunday was definitely laid out to favour higher horsepower/faster vehicles!

Okay, here's the layout of the course which we were handed upon our arrival. I've added the words "Start" and "Finish". I've also added the phrase "Twice around" to indicate that we were to go around the figure eight two times.

I'd say the size of the course is pretty close to the size of a football field, although if anyone knows the actual dimensions, please post them. As you can see, this was quite a straightforward course which allowed the faster vehicles to open 'er up a bit. Colby and I were hoping for a layout with plenty of tight turns and no straightaways , but what the heck, we still did well and had a good time doing it!

[EDIT] Does anyone still have a copy of the printout of the course from last month? It would be interesting to see it posted for comparison purposes.

Colby, you're a wealth of information!

I like the look of the July 31st course. That's a layout designed for duke powered Fieros!

Cheese wrote: I'm not sure, but I think I remember hearing that it's 1000' x 250'. EDIT: http://forum.pca-cwr.org/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3220 - yep .

Is that the size of the entire paved area, parking and all? If so, I wonder how much of its length is actually used for the course itself?

Cheese wrote: If you read the topic I linked to, you would see: Rich_Sandor wrote:   ...parking and grid easily take up 1/4 of our 1000' skipad

Guilty as charged!