The Indy car from Burnaby that I recently purchased on Ebay, is now in my driveway in North Vancouver. The car has every factory option except cruise control, and I hope to add that as well from the parts car. 

It has a bit of damage and abuse including:

• An engine fire (started by a grass fire) that wiped out quite a bit of the wiring around the engine and the deck lid, but apparently not the engine itself.
• A bit of damage to the front facsia.
• Damage to the LHS quarter panel. It will need to be replaced.
• Body rust completely through (two fist sized holes) immediately below the battery shelf, presumably to be replaced by a $ 90 Fierostore patch panel, unless someone has game plan B.
• Damaged dash pad (light grey), and seeking a replacement.

Some parts, including the carpet are in remarkably good condition, and the seats are OK for now. Generally the body is decent.

I purchased a 84 SE Auto that is stored in Langley until mid-November when I will bring it here for a fast dismantling and disposal. That car was on Craigslist a couple of months ago in Maple Ridge with a bad engine. It was sold, driven to Abbotsford, then Langley (same bad engine) where it appears to have breathed its last breath. It is almost too good to dismember, but it appears to have been well looked after and will provide needed 84 parts plus lots of compatabale spares and other replacemtn parts. Other than the few commitments that I have made to Paul Schinkel (recently purched 85 SE V6 Auto who covets the roof / sunroof), I will want to get rid of everything that is not relevant to the Indy. Anybody have a want ir wish list?

Patrick Sheridan and Pail Schinkel visted today. Thanks guys. 

I just now noticed the size limitation on jpgs, so my intention to post photos tonight will have to wait a bit.

And thanks to David for providing both good data and good advise.

Gary Hawthorn @604-986-8199

Indy wrote: I just now noticed the size limitation on jpgs, so my intention to post photos tonight will have to wait a bit.

I use http://www.irfanview.ca/ - IrfanView for all my image resizing needs. It works great, does batch conversion (a whole folder of images can be converted at once) and the price is attractive as well... Free.

The photos that I promised.

My 71 Opel GT insisted on being in one of the photos with Pat and Paul Schinkel. Ask Pat about the primitive but effective headlight hiding system. 

Thanks

Gary

This photo was crying out for cropping and a bit of a massage.

And yes, the hide-a-way headlights on the Opel are really neat.

Gary, it was good to get to know you and Paul a bit. Thanks for having us over.

Patrick wrote: And yes, the hide-a-way headlights on the Opel are really neat.

So nobody's going to ask me what's so neat about the Opel's hide-a-way headlights?

That's a start John (very good!), but how do they "roll around"?

Not to sidetrack Gary's Indy build thread, but http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-TAYIZCVyQ - Here is an interesting video on the Opel GT.

Gary, any progress report on the Indy?

When you and Paul remove the sunroof from the parts car, I'd like to be there (that's assuming you haven't already done it).

Three weeks later and my 84 SE AT parts car, other than the body is mainly stripped. It has been a good parts car since it has quite a few of the accessories that are on my Indy MT so has provided either lots of spares or replacement parts. This has been quite useful in the engine compartment where there was more fire damage that was initially apparent.

Before I started to dismantle the SE I ran the engine briefly (lots of noise), did a compression check (all < 90 psi), and checked the electrics (all working).

To date, I have done the following on the SE:

• removed the engine (from below), and partially dismantled.
• removed brakes, partial wiring harness, console, fuel tank, rad and fan, headlights. acjt

Since my priority is to get the (s)hell out of my driveway, I have not done much on the Indy. Since the Indy engine appears not have turned over for a few years, I rotated it by hand, gave the cylinders a dose of oil, and the next day did a compression check ( 150 - 180 psi - perhaps influenced by residual oil, since I did give it a bath).

I pulled the engine compartment wiring and ECM harnesses and was planning on swapping them over, and can still do so. However, it is not plug and play, since the AT is a bit more complicated than for the MT in the Indy, something that could be overcome with some wiring changes. Game plan B is to get those harnesses from an 84 MT, and just swap them over. Does anybody know whether the 84 2M4 that is at Pick-A-Part still has the engine, in which case the harnesses that I need may still be there?

Although the body on the SE is excellent, (both fron t and rear fascias are perfect) I will save only a couple of panels so if anyone wants anything (the AT?) please contact me. What does not go to club memebers, I will try to get rid of on Craigslist. Maybe we will get lucky and find a new cub member. 

Rust - the Indy has a rusted battery shelf and fist sized holes immediately below in the body, but otherwise is OK. The SE has the same rust, plus the frequent rust through beside the trunk, plus the top end of both front shocks.   

Gary hawthorn @604-986-8199

Oops pushed the wrong button.

A few more photos

Gary

Indy wrote: Game plan B is to get those harnesses from an 84 MT, and just swap them over. Does anybody know whether the 84 2M4 that is at Pick-A-Part still has the engine, in which case the harnesses that I need may still be there?

Gary, three of us were there yesterday (as reported http://www.westcoastfieros.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?FID=13&TID=2213&PN=1&get=last - Here ), and yes, the engine is still in that '84. It's pretty well picked over, but something like the harness is probably still in there. Hopefully, no one has cut plugs/connections off the harness. 

Dawg wrote: Wow....looks like you've got some serious rust there.  I can help you with that....PM for more info.

I don't think Gary cares much about rust on the parts car. It's going to be scrapped!

Guys

I just returned from my first ever trip to pickapart. As Pat guessed, the wiring harnesses that I wanted were intact other than the main harness to C500 having been spliced just behind the shifter. That is no problem since I will splice in that location anyway.

Nice warmish sunny day and a well spent 2 hr there + 2 hours driving.

I now have three clutch slave cylinders and all are rusty. I am thinking about replacing the small rubber boot with a large bellows type and seal it at both ends so that it will expand when the clutch is depressed and not merely suck in moist West Coast air whenever the clutch returns to its rest position. Comments?

Anybody have any spare 4 cyl MT engine mounts? My LF one appears to have had a bit of fire damage and the one from the AT is a bit different (I need to check that). Should I just replace all of them?

About the rust through - I have a MIG welder so when I am replacing the battery shelf (anybody have a new one for sale?) I will weld in patches from the top side. However, thanks for the offer. 

Anybody have any NOS dew wipes. The 84 is different than the later years but according to fierostores the later ones can be adapted, and pretty much have to be since the 84 versions are no longer available.

Cheers

Gary

Regarding the 84 SE parts car, does it still have the steering wheel and which steering wheel is it?

I have the steering wheel and am not planning on keeping it.

Tilt steering with cruise control.

Please call me at 604-986-8199

Guys

The wiring harnesses that I got from PickAPart are in good condition. However, I am quickly learing that although the difference between AT and MT is a bit important, what are far more important are the installed options, particularly aircon and to a lesser extent cruise control.

The MT harnesses from PAP (both the three C500 associated ones and the ECM) are a good fit for my MT, but the PAP harnesses includes cruise that my Indy does not have and it does not have aircon, that I do have.

I now plan to not install the cruise control, since I see that it is more effort than I am prepared to expend. I am inclined to merely clip the cruise wires, most or all of which go only through C500.

Right now aircon is not important. However the aircon wiring involves quite a few connections to the ECM, via C504, C505, and C203. I can easilly transfer the correct connectors from my now junk Indy ECM harness. However if I use my Indy ECM (that believes it has an attached aircon) and don't complete the aircon wiring, will the ECM view that as a fault and send an unimportant fault message, while perhaps not idenfying a real fault? 

It is not that big of a task to install a harness, so options are to go with what I have for now, or right now find an 84 ECM harness from a car with aircon. If someone for the club does not have access to one, I will try Pennock's.

Am I making it more or less complicated than it is?

One other item. The brown dash from the 84 SE is in perfect condition, unlike the light grey / black one from the Indy. If anyone has a perfect grey / black one, I am in the market. Game plan B is to paint the one from the SE. Is that a good idea?

thanks

Gary @604-986-8199

Dawg

You were right about fierostore and matching paint. Thanks.

Wiring harness

I stared at the ECM harness for a while and realized that the only problem was getting the missing aircon wires (but now transferred  from the fire damaged Indy harness) through the bulkhead.  I opened up the grey / black "heat / noise seal" that goes throught the bulkhead and decided that with a bit of heat and perhaps some filing, I can create a cableway for those 4 wires.

Within a couple of days I should be able to test out the electrical circuits. 

Cheers

Gary

Year end progress report

The various wiring harness are now installed with just a few bare ends. When I started the engine yesterday for the first time, the "check engine" light went out, so I expect that is a good sign. The engine does sound decent, but it runs for only a few seconds, then dies, but will immediately restart and does the same thing again and again. Part of the hobby. 

I bought a GT front fascia with the later round molding design, and am adapting it to the earlier ribbed molding type that was used 84 to 86. On the later versions the side marker and molding that connect the fascia to the fender are one piece and merely bolt on. On the earlier version, the short molding "piece" immediately behind the marker light is part of the fascia. I cut them off the damaged Indy fascia with a hacksaw and used plastic filler and abit of stainless stell wire to install a small mounting bolt. see photo below.

The SE dash has now been repainted and installed in the Indy. Looks very good. I did a small repair to a crack in the upper corner using body filler, after gouging out the soft foam to get to a solid attachment. Pretty much invisible repair.

The headliner was still decent on the Indy otheer than the fwater damaged fabric, but it was very difficult (I am inclined to say impossible) to remove the upper interior door molding with it in place. I therefore cut the headliner in two (see photo) and slid it out, then easily accessed the 6 mm headed machine screw that secures the mounting clip (there will be 1 or 2 of them on each side). Once the molding was off the car I was easily able to remove the spring clip(s) that were still attached to it, then remounted the clip to the body in preparation for re-installation. I fiberglassed the headliner back together and painted to for additional strength. And yes I will drill the drain holes on the sunroof surround.  

In dismantling the brake system on both cars, I noticed that the torx end on several of the caliper mounting bolts were poorly formed and I had difficulty removing them. After-market junk. 

Since the SE parts car is now stripped of everything but the main roof, and since many of those panels are in better condition than on the Indy, I decided to paint the panels off the car and with the aero body parts also removed. A March or April project. I am now wondering how to remount the riveted aero body side molding etc.  since the rivets were destroyed on removal. I will post a separate question about that on the site so that any answers don't get lost in this thread.  

Since this is mainly a one person project, I had difficulty re-aligning the rear suspension after I loosened the two large bolts. By installing a spare rotor backwards, I was able to realign the parts with my floor jack.  

There was some rust under the parts car carpet, (photo) so I will check that on the Indy while the seats are out.  

Gary in North Vancouver @ 604-986-8199

Another update

Some of this might actually be useful to someone else.

Fuel Pressure

The engine would initially run for only a few seconds. I assembled a  spool piece using fuel line from the parts car and determined that the fuel pressure was only 4 psi. After dropping the fuel tank the only problem was the 1 1/2" long rubber hose that connects the fuel pump to the steel discharge pipe. The hose was very spongy and was destined to fail. I installed the spare fuel pump with hose clamps as someone suggested on Pennock's. 11 psi now, well within the 10 - 12 psi specs. The engine now runs and should be OK with a tune up.

Oil Pressure

I also installed a "hydraulic" oil pressure gauge that I will leave permanently mounted in the engine compartment. 25 psi oil pressure.

.

Compression

The engine compression is 140 - 160 after running for perhaps 15 minutes. 

Clutch

Next problem was the clutch system that no matter how many times it was bled never managed to move the clutch arm more than 1/2", and not enough to disengage the clutch. There was no apparent problem with the clutch pedal (no "bent pedal" syndrome). The "stamped" clutch arm had been replaced with the cast version. However when I disconnected the banjo, the pedal jumped up by about 1/2", so that it "rested" above the brake pedal. The 1984 version of the clutch pedal has what has been described as a redundant wound spring, and that is what caused the pedal to rise. Although it would have been less effort to buy one of Rodney's adjustable master cylinder push rods, that would not have contributed to the "hobby". I therefore removed the master cylinder, cut the push rod shaft and brazed in a 1/2" long piece of round bar of the same diameter as the push rod. To secure it better than perhaps was necessary, I salvaged a 3" long piece of fuel line from the parts car and slotted it full length. With a small interference fit it was quite tight even prior to brazing. Installed it, bled the system, and presto, the clutch now works for the first time.

The push rod was initially 6 3/8" long and now is 6 7/8". The 1/8" is not important, but the extra 1/2" is what provided sufficient travel on the master cylinder for the slave to work properly. Rodney's website stated that he had seen "short" push rods on several after market master cylinders. 

Dew Wipes

There is another way to remove the outer dew wipe, but it works only if you can justify removing or at least loosening the outer door skin. With the windown down, the fasteners are all easily accessed with a conventional Phillips screwdriver and a 10 mm wrench except for the two center screws. The standard way to remove them is with a tool from Rodney or a home-made equivalent. Since I was going to remove the skin for painting in any case, I used the opportunity to easily "back out" the centre screws.

When I replace the dew wipes, I plan to reverse the center two screws and install them from the outside.

There are "fastener" distributors in the US selling generic dew wipes in 8' lengths at less than $ 30 (the Fiero dew wipes are 36 1/2" long). The catalog that I have shows wipes that are pretty close, so I am going to contact the supplier to see whether they can locate identical replacement Fiero moldings to which the old, and still good attachments can be re-fitted. Long shot, but it is a hobby. Has anybody been able to do that? 

Headliner Fabric

We went to Bellingham a few days ago and bought 1 1/2 yard (about 52 " width) of light grey headliner fabric at Jo-Ann Fabric in the large retail complex just west of I-5 in downtown Bellingham. That length will be sufficient for the sun visors as well. They have a few colours in stock, all foam backed.

Jo-Ann is a USA wide fabric store that has been mentioned in Pennock's by several Fiero owners as a good source of head lining fabric. 

A bonus is that Jo-Ann's is just around the corner from the recently opened Harbor Freight store.

Cheers

Gary Hawthorn

Harbour Freight, you gotta get me an address, my wife and I go to Bellisfair Mall twice a month or so now.  If there is a Harbour Freight anywhere close by, she can drop me off there and I might be done by the time she is done looking through the entire mall.  If she left me with the car I might not be picking her up until the following day.

        Your car is coming along amazingly well.  Funny that hose went bad, as I just replaced one in my now sold 88 Coupe.  Owner thought the motor was blown because it would not run.  I replaced the hose and installed a V6 fuel pump and car ran fine, new owner drove it all the way to Victoria, said it just kept driving better and better the more he drove it.  Aside from an oil leak I think the engine may have been fine.

I'll have to keep that fabric store in mind as I will need to redo the head liner on my 88GT once I get the windshield replaced, as it is leaking badly at the top of the glass.

25psi at hot idle is OK, however I like to see more like 35psi, I would move it up to 10w30 and add a bottle of Lucas oil stabilizer to the mix.  If your tests were done with less than 1hr of run time, I would move to 15w40 Rotella oil.  Its great stuff. and was the only thing GM would put in there Caddy motors.

Indy wrote: I therefore removed the master cylinder, cut the push rod shaft and brazed in a 1/2" long piece of round bar of the same diameter as the push rod... and presto, the clutch now works for the first time.

...

Indy wrote: I also installed a "hydraulic" oil pressure gauge that I will leave permanently mounted in the engine compartment. 25 psi oil pressure. .

What's with the upside-down picture?

Folks

Attached is a map showing the location of Jo-Ann Fabric. Turn left at the second set of lights on Sunset East (Hwy 542). Harbor Freight is straight ahead partially hidden behind a couple of conifers. Jo-Ann's is a little jog to the left and just around the corner. The headliner fabric is against the back wall more-or-less in line with the cutting table, and about waist high. The clerk who gave us directions did not actually put us at the right location, and it was just dumb luck that we actually found what we were looking for in about 1 meter of shelf space.

And yes the oil pressure sender photo is from the bottom side. It was the only position from which I could get a decent photo.

I contacted the generic dew wipe material supplier. The guy I talked to deferred to someone else who will not be back until Friday. Apparently they have access to other profiles, since what is in their catalog is not quite correct for the Fiero. Can I reasonably assume that the wipe itself is the same for all Fieros and the 84 differs only in the accessory mounting? If anybody is keen to replace their dew wipes I can order more than the 1 - 8' "stick" just for me, providing what they have is correct and not merely a poor substitute. Probably < $ 30 for the standard 8' length. I will have them cut it into 2 pieces since the long length incurs higher shipping costs and you cannot get more than 2 wipes out of 8'. 

I am away and won't be at the February meeting, but March should work for me.

Cheers

Gary

Indy wrote: And yes the oil pressure sender photo is from the bottom side. It was the only position from which I could get a decent photo.

Gary, there's this great feature in photo programs called "rotate".

Indy wrote: I contacted the generic dew wipe material supplier. The guy I talked to deferred to someone else who will not be back until Friday. Apparently they have access to other profiles, since what is in their catalog is not quite correct for the Fiero. Can I reasonably assume that the wipe itself is the same for all Fieros and the 84 differs only in the accessory mounting? If anybody is keen to replace their dew wipes I can order more than the 1 - 8' "stick" just for me, providing what they have is correct and not merely a poor substitute. Probably < $ 30 for the standard 8' length. I will have them cut it into 2 pieces since the long length incurs higher shipping costs and you cannot get more than 2 wipes out of 8'.

Gary, I imagine you've seen this thread http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/072583.html - Here comparing the two types of ready-made dew wipes that are available to Fiero owners? Great info there.

I'm definitely interested in hearing what you find out from your supplier. Do you also have access to the dew wipe "pad" material from that same supplier?

If it turns out that the raw material you can get will indeed do the job, you might wish to post about this in a thread of its own as not everyone will be looking in an Indy "build thread" for info which might be of benefit to their non-Indy Fiero.

June update

Since the last posting in January, I have made significant progress:

• All of the body panels have been painted off the vehicle, except the two roof sections that were too much of a hastle to remove. I don't have sufficient room in my garage to do the painting there, so I painted everything outside. There was of course the risk of airborne debris (that did happen) plus  natural lighting is not as favourable as light reflected from overhead fluorescent lights.
• The only remaining painting are the wheels and the two roof sections to be completed in the next few days, if the rain god permits.
• New headliner, with fabric from Bellingham. Looks good.
• Drilled drain holes at the four corners of the sun roof.
• Modified the wiring to stop the temp gage from pegging. I followed the procedure that is frequently discussed in Pennock's,  in which the instument panel etc. is removed. It did not provide sufficient access to the connectors that are in the top of the steering column, so I lowered the column and the job went well after that.
• New outer dew wipes. Since the door skin was off the car, access to the two center mounting screws was quite easy, and I merely backed them out, then installed pop rivets to replace them. The rest of the fasteners went back together the way they were originally installed. 
• Bought a used Indy passenger side seat skin (thanks Pennock's) and used it to replace the driver's side skin. Not perfect, but not too shabby.
• The mounting fasteners for the door skins look good, but the plastic "covers" don't tolerate either the Phillips screwdriver (early 84) or the later torx fasteners at all well. I ended up with a couple of frozen fasteners, so drilled them out and replaced the mounting plates. I ground the plastic away from the concealed metal fasteners before I mounted the skins. 
• Replaced the front fascia with one from the now gone Lynden Fiero guy. 
• Bought rebuilt sun visors. They are frequently sold on eBay at far less effort and cost than it would be to do it yourself.

I have registered the Fiero (and the 71 Opel GT) in the July 17 Show & Shine in Edgemont Village, just a couple of blocks from my home in N. Vancouver, so I have imposed a dealine on completion. 

I have a small want list that I will post separately.

Having the 84 SE parts car was a real blessing since the body was in better shape than the Indy, so it provided several replacement body panels and was an excellent source of fasteners, etc. 

Cheers

Gary Hawthorn

Mods, please get this SPAM out of here. Thanks.

[EDIT] Whomever did it, thanks for getting rid of that crap.