Car dies when idling
Printed From: West Coast Fieros
Category: Technical Topics Forum
Forum Name: Technical Questions and Discussions
Forum Description: Got a technical question about your fiero? ask it here.
URL: http://www.westcoastfieros.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3064
Printed Date: 22 November 2024 at 11:31am
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Topic: Car dies when idling
Posted By: InfernoFiero
Subject: Car dies when idling
Date Posted: 20 October 2012 at 2:52am
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Hello, I was driving my car today, and, fortunately, it died right before continuing on the lions gate bridge ramp -- it died while idling in traffic -- and so I tried turning the car on numerous times and hitting the accelerator until it worked. It seems like when the car is stopped, the idle rpm goes lower and lower until it stops. Earlier in the summer one of the intake tubes -- the aluminum tube that is in charge of bringing warm air to the engine -- was severed and I never got around to replacing that, or fixing it for that matter. Is this the culprit to my car dieing on idle? |
Replies:
Posted By: Dr.Fiero
Date Posted: 21 October 2012 at 9:34am
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Might want to mention exactly what you have (year, engine, etc).
If it's a V6 (stock), a hot ignition module is a common cause of 'quick death'. On occasion it will restart after cooling off. But it's just a few degrees away from permanent death after that. And I'm sure you would have run into it if you've been driving the car for any length of time but.... what does your gas gauge read? A LOT of them are wrong and you'll run out at 1/4 tank. |
Posted By: InfernoFiero
Date Posted: 21 October 2012 at 11:43am
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Oh yeah, I have a 1984 Fiero w. 2.5L engine and it is an automatic. Before making the trip, I had just filled up gas at Chevron, however; truth to be told, my Fiero was VERY low on gas just as I was making my way to the gas station -- where I filled up -- and the station is 5-10 mins away from where my car died then after. |
Posted By: InfernoFiero
Date Posted: 21 October 2012 at 12:53pm
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I left my car on idle today: I had it in park for 10 minutes and it didn't taper off, and I put it on drive for a few minutes and it didn't die, either. |
Posted By: Dr.Fiero
Date Posted: 21 October 2012 at 1:04pm
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No, you can get air bubbles that cause grief in a diesel engine, but not a gas one (not one that would show up 15 minutes later anyhow). One thing you could look at is the squarish 4 pin connector that goes to your IAC (google it for the exact location picture). I've seen those go bad, and you'll loose idle control. Get it idling, then wiggle it up and down and see if things go bad. Or worse. It's not a huge deal to replace them anymore, since you can get brand new ones from Pico (via Lordco). |
Posted By: InfernoFiero
Date Posted: 21 October 2012 at 1:13pm
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Alright thanks Dr. Fiero, but before I check the connector, could me filling up my gas past the first click, and stop at the second click -- that day was the first time I have went beyond the first click -- be a reasonable guess in my car dieing too? I was reading pages that filling up past the first click is detrimental and leads to stalls? |
Posted By: Dr.Fiero
Date Posted: 21 October 2012 at 1:27pm
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Not likely. It'll just possibly lead to raw gas getting into your evap canister. Don't loose any sleep over it. |
Posted By: beken
Date Posted: 22 October 2012 at 9:42am
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This is the time of year where fuel companies are changing over to winter spec gasolines. Even my MINI coughs and sputtered a bit when cold on the first full tank of recent fuel. Once you get to the second tank, your engine computer will have adjusted and things should go back to normal.
You might notice this also happens in late April early May timeframe. -------------  Beken (aka Ken) - bekentech@westcoastfieros.com Original and still the owner of an 85SE 2M6 4spd |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 22 October 2012 at 12:52pm
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If you have not changed the plugs in a long time, I would change them and have the timing checked. It should be set about 2 degree's over factory spec. This will help with the Winter Gas issue. As I have mentioned in the past, the fuel that our cars was designed for some 30 years ago, is drastically different than what we have now, and especially considering the injectors don't flow nearly as well as they did when new, a little timing and good plugs go a long way. I wont' go into the IAC issue as the Dr has already brought that up, but an old slower IAC can have issues getting the idle speed correct in an automatic car. ------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: InfernoFiero
Date Posted: 31 October 2012 at 1:36pm
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hey guys, i cheched the IAC and it seemed fine, and so I drove the car with no problems for two times without any hitches. Just yesterday, however, my car was driving fine but my rpm neelde would twitch every 5-10 seconds from the 1 rpm to 1.5-- the twitches were not smooth at all from the needle perspective -- so I immediately parked the car at home and didn't touch it since. Do you think the tach filter is the culprit, or as I was reading in the pennocks forum database that a dead battery could be the cause, too -- my radio settings keep reseting. Any other bigger or underliying issues that could be behind this? |
Posted By: Dawg
Date Posted: 01 November 2012 at 2:43am
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This means you are not getting proper spark from the ignition system.
On the 2.8 V6 motors, it almost always means either a bad pick up coil or a fried ignition module. DG ------------- You dream it up....I'll make it |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 01 November 2012 at 3:21am
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Dawg is dead on, even though your car is a duke, pull the dist shaft, or have a shop pull the dist shaft and rebuild it. Just make darn sure that if you do it, take LOTS and LOTS of Pics at every step. IE, Take pics of the cap before you start, then remove the wires and remove the dist cap take a ton more pics. Then remove the hold down bolt and bracket and wiggle the dist shaft out. Take many more pics of the shaft itself. Now punch the roll pin out and start rebuilding your shaft. 9 times out of 10 if the tach goes wonky before it dies, the dist shaft components are to blame.
The reason for all the pics is that the plug wires MUST go back in the same spots as they came from. The dist shaft MUST go back in the exact same spot it came out of, with the rotor pointing in the exact same spot. If any of this is not correct the motor won't run at all and you will be spending a ton of money to have a shop come out and sort out the issues ------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: InfernoFiero
Date Posted: 01 November 2012 at 2:10pm
| Oh great... This is going to be the straw that beaks the camels back. How much would I be looking at if I took it to a shop to rebuild it -- labor and material wise? |
Posted By: Capt Fiero
Date Posted: 01 November 2012 at 2:34pm
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Honestly I don't know, It’s about a 30min job to remove, 30mins to rebuild and 30mins to re-install and time. (honestly it could be done faster, but shops have to include time to get tools, use them and put them away as well as clean up) Depending on their rates and parts prices I would say around $200. Honestly if I were you, I would learn to do it myself, just take lots of pics in case you don't remember where something went. Call around to places like Lordco and Napa and Alder Auto Parts to get quotes on module/pickup coil, and maybe new cap and rotor while you are at it. Last time I looked for a V6 the Module was about 90 and the pickup coil was about 15. I expect it to be similar price for the duke.
------------- Capt Fiero 88 Fiero GT 5spd V6 Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd. |
Posted By: InfernoFiero
Date Posted: 04 November 2012 at 12:00pm
| Lordco has has the module at 130 and the pickup coil at 70. Yeah, I'll take my time in choosing the most cheapest parts haha. They did have the distributor at 220, so would that be more labour-wise easy to install? |
Posted By: Patrick
Date Posted: 04 November 2012 at 3:35pm
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Good gawd! Perhaps you should read my comments (two posts) about Lordco posted http://www.westcoastfieros.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?FID=1&TID=3071&PN=1&get=last - Here .
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InfernoFiero wrote:
Posted By: InfernoFiero
Date Posted: 05 November 2012 at 10:33am
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Hey thanks, I examiend the prices with North Shore Auto Parts and they too were pretty close within range of the prices of Lordco. That being said, I did examine that rockauto site, Patrick, and the prices are WAY cheap in comparison; consequently, I'm going to have my orders done through there. So I would be getting the ignition control module (I hope you guys meant this for module I would need), ignition coil (is this the pickup coil you guys were refering to?), distributor cap and rotor (the cap and rotor you guys were refering to I think???). Anyways, kindest regrads. |
Posted By: Patrick
Date Posted: 05 November 2012 at 11:41am
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Before you spend a bunch of money on perhaps unnecessary ignition components...
That tube brings heated air up from the duke's exhaust manifold to the air filter snorkel to help the engine run/idle when it's cold. If I had an automatic, I'd want that functional for sure. It's less of an issue with a manual tranny IMO.
There's a chance that you possibly sucked some crap up from the bottom of your gas tank and plugged up the fuel filter when you let the gas get so low. If you haven't already, I'd change the fuel filter and see how the engine runs before throwing money at the ignition.
I don't know who was referring to what, but keep in mind that the ignition coil and pick-up coil are two different animals. One last comment regarding RockAuto... It's a great place to order from, especially if you don't have to ship across the border. Use one of those drop-ship places just over the border in the US (costs about $5 per shipment) and bring the goods across yourself. If you absolutely need to have the goods shipped directly to you in Canada, only use USPS for shipping. Otherwise you'll be gouged big-time by the private carriers for "brokerage" fees.
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Posted By: Dawg
Date Posted: 05 November 2012 at 11:31pm
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Reread the thread Patty. His tach is acting eratically. Very likely he
needs ignition parts. Dawg ------------- You dream it up....I'll make it |
Posted By: Patrick
Date Posted: 06 November 2012 at 1:14am
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Maybe so... but not from Lordco.
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Posted By: InfernoFiero
Date Posted: 08 November 2012 at 4:23pm
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I turned on my car yesterday, and, to my surprise, it worked -- though felt very underpowered -- and took it to the car shop. I requested an oil-change for starters because I realized my car was low on oil, and I thought this was the culprit -- though it had to be VERY low on oil for it to have rpm issues, something that I just learned. I also had the the manifold tube reattached. Once done, I drove home and going up hill (I live by Grouse) my car had it's tremors and then bam, it peaked over 2.5 rpms and died. I managed to pull to the side to start it over again, and brought it over to the mechanic shop immediately. Upon their inspection they found that the air condition tube was the cause of all this mess: the air condition tube was sucking up water and bringing said water internally and as a result my spark plugs all rusted, and my fuel injector, air filter and fuel filter were all soaken wet. Ignition wires were also rusted too. Upon recommendation, the distrubtor cap, ignition rotor, spark plugs, igniton wires, air filter and fuel filter have all been replaced. The problematic tube that was sucking up all the water was removed so I don't have to look forward to internal leaks like that again; however, if car problem still persist, then it would be the fuel injector -- it wasn't replaced but dried, hopefully it didn't crap out because it got wet so i'm going to optimistically hope for the best. On a higher note, I feel a much more stronger performance of my car, and I was able to drive up the hill no problem. Fortunately, the shop took kidneys as a form of payment -- the extraction of said kidney was free of charge too -- so it was all good on that end. |
Posted By: Patrick
Date Posted: 08 November 2012 at 4:36pm
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Air condition tube? Please explain what it is you're referring to.
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Posted By: ARTIC-1
Date Posted: 08 November 2012 at 5:31pm
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Thats a real interesting.Where on earth did you take your car? I never even herd of that before- -air condition tube was the cause of all this mess: the air condition tube was sucking up water and bringing said water internally- All so-? spark plugs all rusted-there made of rubber just the ends are metal in side the boot,and inside is made of fiberglass strains coated in graphite. not much to rust there.would love to help you with your Fiero if i can.there are lots of people here that know everything there is to know about the cool little car-Fiero.one will need a little more info from you about your car so a good ? guess can be made to just what is wrong. hope all is good know for you, an running fine.  Snow ------------- SNOW MAN 87-GT/AUTO-2.8_ WHITE 88-TTop/ Duke-2.5. RED |
Posted By: Dawg
Date Posted: 08 November 2012 at 11:03pm
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Sounds odd to me also. Can't imagine what they are talking about. Dawg ------------- You dream it up....I'll make it |