3.5L LX9 Swap into ’86 2M6 4 speed

Some fairly minor updates. Got 3 of 4 rubber cradle
bushings out so far, hopefully the last one will be out
by Monday and hopefully the engine will be going back
into the car Monday as well. I'm debating whether or not
I should do the polyurethane bushings on my rear control
arms now as well but I assume that means getting a rear
alignment. If they hadn't come with the engine I
probably never would have bought them. Anybody have
personal experiences they could share as to what
differences aluminium cradle bushings and/or polyurethane
control arm bushings make?

Here's a pic of the engine about to be mounted to the
cradle finally:


In the next pic you'll see the motor mount nut is almost
touching the new oil pan. I carefully threaded it as I
lowered the engine onto the mount because I did not feel
comfortable 'clearancing' the oil pan.


Another pic of the complete cradle assembly:


Next question I have is about the ignition coils. Are
they in the right order? (This is the way they were when
I got them). Edit: These are indeed in the correct
order.


And finally I got an alternator and found a belt to fit
(IIRC the size was 640). Originally I wasn't going to
use the idler pulley right by the alternator, but since
the belt was too short otherwise and I didn't want to go
back to Lordco for a fourth time, I added it and the belt
fit great. It's just as well as it gives the alternator
a bit more grip. And for the record I ended up buying an
alternator for a '99 Cavalier 2.4L as it came close to
bolting up to the 3500 alt bracket and was only $55
(we'll see how long it lasts though). The two bolt holes
on the side line up and the through bolt is a bit off but
I think it will be fine for now. On my LT1 in my other
car my A/C delete pulley is only held on by 2/3 bolts as
well and it's held up fine. I did have to switch the
pulley to one from an '01 Malibu though because the 2.4
Cavalier pulley was for a 5-rib belt. I still need to
get a pigtail for the alternator. Anyways that's the end
of my rant.


CFoss: If I'm gonna be borrowing your tuning equipment we
should probably meet up some time. What part of Duncan
do you live in?

When you're ready, I'm near Queen of Angels school, towards Maple Bay on Tzouhalem road.

When do you think you'll need it?

Do you want me to see if I have a prom that'll work after you're done tuning? I think I have some EEproms (fast rewritable) around here somewhere.

I'm jealous of your serpentine belt. I hate the slippage on the old v belts!

Chay

I was also thinking since I don't know yet how my exhaust
is going to be routed and (correct me if I'm wrong) the
7730 ECM only supports 1 O2 sensor, I would use the
existing O2 bungs and tune 1 bank at a time. To simplify
switching between O2 sensors I would build an extension
harness to reach around to the O2 sensor on the opposite
side. I just don't know yet how the Y-pipe will be
routed/if I will have a Y-pipe.

Right on!

My parents live off of Payne Rd. (About 2 minutes from the old firehall) so I do know what you're talking about!

The 7730 does only support 1 02. I suspect that both banks will perform about the same, so there will be no need to switch back and forth. You may want to do it just to check everything is similar. You are using batch fire anyway, so you can't tune the sides independently.

" I just don't know yet how the Y-pipe will be
routed/if I will have a Y-pipe. "

Does this mean you're considering a dual exhaust?

Chay

I don't think you are crazy, but I don't think there is any performance enhancement. The wye pipe can be kinda hard to build if you don't have the tools to do it.

I did some 'inside work' on my car the last few days. Kinda cold and still dark by 6 or so.

I'm going to use a single 2.5 or 3" glasspack on my car. I don't really care how it sounds though, just how it goes! I'll have the turbo in the way consuming some noise too.

The gasket maker will make a mess if you have to remove the throttle body. I've used the generic in the past with lots of success.

I actually have some hanging around if you need it.


Chay

If there is a starting tune it's always nice to have, that's for sure. It'll save you a bunch of time.

I like the zif socket on the G1. Mine's an old press socket, the zifs are much nicer for repeated connections.

1 thing I did do was sharpie the code revision and type ($whatever) on the ecm so I woudn't forget what I have in there. I just checked that out so I was glad it was there. Amazing what you forget over a year!


Oil...there's a way to start a flame war! I always ask if anyone has ever worn an engine out. I haven't yet and I've really tried (I went broke trying to finish off my old Ford 351...just wouldn't die, had to sell it).

I was looking at some braided fuel line you can attach tips to so you can custom it up (Summit racing).

Something like this:

http://www.summitracing.com/search/Part-Type/Fuel-System-Plu mbing-Kits/?keyword=braided+fuel+line

I haven't quite got there though.


Chay

CFoss wrote: If there is a starting tune it's always nice to have, that's for sure. It'll save you a bunch of time.I like the zif socket on the G1. Mine's an old press socket, the zifs are much nicer for repeated connections.1 thing I did do was sharpie the code revision and type ($whatever) on the ecm so I woudn't forget what I have in there. I just checked that out so I was glad it was there. Amazing what you forget over a year!Oil...there's a way to start a flame war! I always ask if anyone has ever worn an engine out. I haven't yet and I've really tried (I went broke trying to finish off my old Ford 351...just wouldn't die, had to sell it).I was looking at some braided fuel line you can attach tips to so you can custom it up (Summit racing).Something like this: http://www.summitracing.com/search/Part-Type/Fuel- System-Plu mbing-Kits/?keyword=braided+fuel+line I haven't quite got there though. Chay

Thanks for the tips on the fuel lines. I might see if I
can find something at a junkyard too that will fit. It
looks like the G6 calls for a 5w-30 oil. Not sure if
I'll go synthetic or not.

I test-fitted some radiator hoses today and I think I can
make the ones I already have work. Here are the hoses:

They're for an 87-92 IIRC F-body and they're Goodyear
Super Hi-Miler hoses. They came with my Firebird I
bought last year and have no use for them in that car but
it looks like they just might fit a 3.5L in a Fiero.

I'm thinking this one will work if I snip it where my
hand is (passenger's side):

And this one might work without trimming on the driver's
side:


I do have questions about the heater core lines though.
I see there are two on the fiero. This one on the trunk
side below the dog-bone:

which actually seems to just come out to beside this one
on the firewall side:

Which one is supply and which one is return?

I should probably replace the battery tray soon...


And my driver's side hinge is damaged:

You can see where the metal cable has come out of it's
clamp and there's nothing to prevent the hinge from
lifting futher. Does the hinge need to be replaced? If
so I'm thinking I might just remove it and install a
strut on that side instead.

The heater core doesn't really have an in and out I don't think.

Dawg

So a few updates for tonight. First off, I finished
installing everything and was able to get the engine
cranking but it's not firing. I believe it's not getting
fuel. More on that later.

For the fuel system, I got 4 (3 x 3/8, 1 x 5/16) Dorman
quick disconnect adapters and 4 ft. of fuel injection
hose and clamped everything down. Fuel pressure builds
and holds at about 55 psi and there have been no leaks.
I also added a ground wire for the fuel filter since it's
zip-tied in place and it has a ground strap on it that's
designed to ground static developed by fuel flowing
through the filter.




Pic of the G1 adapter installed in the ECM:


Is it just me or is there more room in front of the
engine with this motor?


Pic of the firewall side of the engine from underneath:


Finished my EGR block-off plate today. Used a piece of
scrap metal that used to do something to hold on the
inner bumper on my Firebird. It's not a work of art but
it gets the job done. For the EVAP solenoid block-off I
was able to use an LT1 manifold EGR block-off plate.



For the intake I was able to get a 45* coupler from Super
Street Imports in Victoria for $20. It fits pretty
nicely although I had to heat it up to slip it over the
air cleaner (3"):


In the next pic you can see my engine-side coolant
filler. $6.50 at Canadian Tire (supposed to be used to
flush cooling system with a garden hose). Filling was a
slow process but I do believe it works:


And finally a pic of the engine just about ready to be
started:


For grounds I used the factory ground strap and added
another 4 gauge ground strap. I'm using the stock
battery cables.

Now on to the starting problems. First thing I did when
it didn't fire was a compression test/test for spark
plugs firing. I did a compression test on the rear 3
cylinders and they read 200, 190, and 200; good
compression in my opinion. At the same time I found that
all 6 cylinders are getting spark (since each coil sparks
a plug on each bank, it should only be necessary to check
3 cylinders to verify spark on all 6). Since I'm not
even getting the odd fire happening at all, I'm convinced
the issue is fuel related.

My friend had the idea that since the regulator is near
the tank there could be a lot of air in the system. We
then bled all the air out of the system by opening the
schrader valve and re-priming. I did find that after
'bleeding' the fuel rail, my gauge indicated that it was
priming much faster than before (not having to compress
air I guess). However that didn't change anything.

As for wiring, I did a basic test to see if the injector
harness was getting a signal to fire. I was reading
about 12V at the injector power wire and during cranking
I saw fluctuating readings at the ECM ground(?) wires.
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but to me this
indicates the injectors are getting a signal to fire.
Another possibility I suppose is that the tune I'm trying
to use (91 3.1L J-body) isn't giving it sufficient fuel
to start the engine. There seems to be no fuel exiting
the exhaust manifolds.

One thing that seemed strange to me is that I can't get
any data to come through the ALDL port (using my ALDL
cable). Is it possible to get data to come through while
using the emulator? In tunerpro RT it just says "DA:
Connecting" when I'm trying to get a datastream.   I've
already verified that this cable works on my friend's 93
Sonoma. Oh and I also tried to jumper the A and B pins
on the connector but that didn't cause the check engine
light to flash. However, the check engine light DOES
light up with key on, engine off as it should. That
indicates that the ECM is at least partially working, I
think. I'm just thinking if I could get a datastream
that it will help determine if the sensors are getting
proper readings and it could also help to indicate any
wiring issues.

Anyways that's where I've left it for tonight, hopefully
tomorrow with a fresh perspective I can make some more
progress.

CFoss wrote: Can you hear the injectors clicking? IF you have an automotive stethescope and can get to the injectors, use it and the injector clicking should be easily audible.

I haven't listened for the injectors and don't have an
automotive stethescope

CFoss wrote: When you say the injector power wire, you mean the one going from the injector to the ecm right (Not the solid +12 one)? If so, you are correct, the wire should go to ground to fire the injector so what you saw is a good thing. I have a handheld scope we can hook up to further analyze this if you want. That way you can actually see the duty cycle, and period of the injector shot.

I've tested both wires (to make sure it's getting
constant power as well)

 

CFoss wrote: I don't remember the '7730 needing a-b. It does require a 2 transistor type cable though, where some of the older ecm only require the 1 transistor type. This could be your issue. I can build you one if you want. The one I have is in use on my boat at the moment. I have found Tunerpro to be more finiky than winaldl, but for the '7730 winaldl won't work (too fast).   Search on 3rd gen for some alternative programs that are stand alone. I know I saw some, but I got the tunerpro working.

The cable I'm using has been known to work with a 7730.
It's from aldlcable.com I've also tried using Freescan
to get data as that's what I use with my other car. Did
I also mention that the fan always turns on with the key
in the on position?

 

CFoss wrote: How did you make out with finding an wideband o2 sensor? I just ordered one which does logging (Zeitronix ZT-2) after I got my last one wet (It died a sad sad death). I'd highly recommed something like it, especially for power enrich settings. I found that I didn't really tune with the ecm, I used the wideband mainly. It is still good to nail down the blm's with a good tune though, so you need it, but it's a little less important.   Chay

I can borrow a wideband from a friend but haven't done so
yet.