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3.5L LX9 Swap into ’86 2M6 4 speed

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bcampbell View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 May 2012 at 9:41pm
I LOVE the sound of this engine. It's funny my friend
was the one driving it mostly at the track on Sunday and
he wouldn't stop revving the engine every chance he got.
Too funny.

The heater core blew Sunday morning but we just did a
quick bypass so it could still go to the track. I drove
my Firebird at autocross and the Fiero beat me by about
1/10 of a second. The hairpin turns really killed me; it
just doesn't have as much steering angle and I couldn't
make up for it with just the stiff suspension. I decided
not to drag my Firebird because my oil pressure was
dropping when coming to a stop (probably oil pump pick-up
fell off oil pump and needs to be welded on).
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2012 at 7:21pm
Just finished painting most of the trim satin black.
It's finally starting to not look like a piece of garbage
on the outside haha.

I'm also posting a few pictures of what it looked like
when I bought it:





And now:

'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Capt Fiero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2012 at 11:15pm
The car looks great.   However my personal taste I would have prefered the red/black look.  Don't get me wrong you did amazing work and paint quality looks great.  Just not a fan of Green/Black as a colour scheme on a Fiero.   Although I have never seen your engine swap in person, it looks to also be top notch and the performance numbers you have posted speak for themselfs. 
Capt Fiero
88 Fiero GT 5spd V6
Eight Fifty Seven GT V8 5spd.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2012 at 6:36pm

Going to Thunder in the Valley 2012. Can't wait to see
some 1/4 mile times and probably going to use a 75 shot of
N2O.
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 August 2012 at 6:49pm
Fiero really surprised me (and everyone else) by running a
13.686 @ 102.68 MPH!!! My friend was driving it for me (I
was driving Firebird) and got a GoPro video of it racing an
LS1 WS6 Trans Am which I will hopefully post soon. That
time really surprised me as I was hoping for a best of
13.9.

We ran the 75 shot of nitrous in 2nd, 3rd, and 4th.
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 December 2012 at 10:28pm
Wow I completely forgot to post the vid!

Here it
is


Car is still running great 25,000 kms later but needs a
new
muffler. My turbo Firebird project is nearing completion
and the Fiero will get attention after that is driveable.


:D
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 July 2013 at 6:34pm
Getting this ready for the Port Alberni drags again; just
pulled the engine out the other day for a max-effort N/A
cam, 8 lb aluminum flywheel, 6-puck ACT clutch, and F23 5-
speed w/LSD. I'm also redoing the fuel system with a
returnless rail and 28# trailblazer injectors, and tidying
things up a bit more. Probably gonna set up the N2O on a
WOT switch this year as well.
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 July 2013 at 3:52am
Got the cam in and installed the new flywheel/clutch.
Also started porting the manifolds. Transmission should
be re-assembled by the weekend.




Despite the 35,000 kms of driving since the swap, the
motor still looks brand new inside :).




Anyone need a 4-speed? I also have a reinforced stock
rear trans mount if anyone wants it. It originally broke
into 3 pieces so we welded it back together with some
1/4" steel pieces to reinforce it. It held really well.
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Bassman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 July 2013 at 7:28pm
4spd trans?...

Good work by the way, looking good
Brian (Bassman)

86 GT Fastback 3.2L

2013 Mazda3 Sport GS SkyActive

[IMG]http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u243/Bassman68/BassmanSignature.png">
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 July 2013 at 1:57am
I actually forgot to post this, but in January the stock
3500 dynoed at 205 whp and 250 ft-lbs wtq. I was really
impressed with those numbers. That's stock manifolds,
stock Fiero air cleaner, untouched engine.

Ya, since I'm installing an LSD'd F23 I should no longer
need the 4-speed manual anymore.

I actually got the cam/valvespring/pushrods for a steal
at $180 shipped because it's the same seller I bought the
3500 turbo manifolds off of for my Firebird.

And after I finish this last round of upgrades I'm
seriously considering selling the car. Kinda wanna
replace it with an Audi A4. This cam won't be as good on
gas as stock but should be plenty fun at the same time.
Supposed to be good for power to/past 7000 rpm and on an
otherwise stock 3400 was expected to make 245 whp. On a
3500 it should make a bit more.

Specs:
Intake 230 .578" lift
Exhaust 236 .573" lift
LCL 110
LSA 112

Oh and rear control arms are getting poly bushings now.
I'll probably do the fronts later as they really should
be done.
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2013 at 1:42am
Finished up the minor porting to the intakes




Put the trans back together now with a rebuilt OBX. My
first time shimming a trans so hopefully this works out
ok.



Did some major wiring cleanup; changed the routing of a
lot of wires and grouped everything together a lot better
than last time. Integrated the nitrous system wiring as
well. Also swapped to a 3400 returnless fuel rail with
28# trailblazer injectors and drilled/tapped the rear
valve cover so I could properly install a breather on it.




Mounted the transmission with Fieroflyer from fiero.nl's
mounts. The mounts are nice and beefy and they work, but
quality could be better. For example some of the
bolt holes needed to be spaced away with washers to make
the other bolt holes line up. Rear side mount had to be
pried a little to get all the bolts started. The nice
thing at least is that after the mounts were installed,
they lined up perfectly with my poly trans mounts.



Had to do a minor notch to the cradle here to clear the
transmission since the mounts were designed for an 88
cradle. Pic also shows poly control arm bushings now
intalled.



Ready to go in the car



Once in the car, I relocated the coolant filler to the
other heater core line to make for a cleaner look. Also,
the heater core line that comes from the front side of
the engine, and routes all the way to the rear, was cut
at the front side right after a weld bead (so that a hose
clamp cannot slip off) so that the line has a much
shorter route.




For the F23 clutch line, I had Island Hose silver solder
a -4 male AN fitting onto the F23 bleeder, and then I cut
the end off the stock braided steel line and installed a
-4 Russell Powerflex hose end. The olive in the hose end
needed to be slightly drilled out due to the Fiero line
being slightly larger than -4 (I'm assuming it's a metric
size). Clutch bled very easily compared to stock and
clutch is disengaging properly. Pedal has a much lighter
feel to it now despite the same pressure plate being
used.

'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2013 at 12:51am
So it's probably time to update the build... Drag racing
didn't go as planned :). Had issues with the shifter all
weekend and the shift cable ended up breaking on one of
the runs. It was actually the best run of the weekend
and ran a 15.x with only 1st and 2nd gear :). Which I
think is pretty decent considering that was NO nitrous
this time and it didn't get a chance to wind out 3rd and
4th gear. Shifting was around 6300 rpm or so as I have
the rev limiter set very conservatively right now.
Powerband of this cam goes past 7000 but I'm nervous to
go that high as the last motor this cam was in left valve
marks on the pistons . That may or may not be
because the timing chain was old and stretched though.

Anyways, after TITV the car mostly sat waiting for parts
for a couple months. Ordered a set of new cables from
California Push-Pull, front poly a-arm bushings, front
poly sway bar end links, front ball joints, and installed
rear coilovers as well. I'm also doing a GT conversion
to it with the next week and painting it again. This time
midnight blue.

Front suspension rebuild has been a HUGE pain. 3 Of the
6 control arm bolts were seized to the bushing sleeves
and the lower ball joints took hours of pressing,
torching, beating, etc... to remove. Oh and two of the
steering rack bolts broke when I went to remove them.
Fun.

After the front suspension rebuild is over with and the
body panels go back on, I still have a couple more things
to do before I put the car up for sale. Rear struts will
be changed out for KYBs, another motor mount will be
added (possibly two if that's not enough), a second
muffler will be added (current exhaust is LOUD... one of
the loudest street cars I've heard... my friend's cammed
LM7-swapped S13 isn't even as loud when straight piped
with NO muffler), and the starter needs to be replaced
since it's pretty much done for.

Pic of how it's sitting now


And of course a vid of the glorious cammed V6 noises
Cammed 3500 Fiero

It's idling at 1300 right now but with more tuning it
should hold 1000 ok. This cam is much more aggressive
than the one I have in my Firebird right now. I think
I'm going to try to get this back on the dyno before it
sells. It should make at least 250 whp if not more based
on simple math and the dyno with the stock cam; stock cam
made 250 ft-lbs of torque and if this cam torque peaks at
over 5252 rpm then it will make 250 hp and likely more.
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 December 2013 at 1:23am
So car is finally ready to go back on the road... almost.
Just needs an alignment really.

Poly bushed the front end... BTW, I discovered that Moog
poly end links actually appear to be MUCH higher quality
than anything offered by energy suspension. And I got
them for $6/side on rockauto. I would highly recommend
them to anyone going to poly end links. I also replaced
both lower front ball joints since it was time they be
done.


Installed all newly painted body panels




Exhaust has now been re-done and is much nicer than
before. I was surprised how quiet it is vs. before but I
do effectively have two mufflers now. I bought a
Dynomax/Walker turbo muffler from Lordco for $26 and re-
used the glasspack as a tip. Had to do a pie-cut to make
the connection from y-pipe to muffler as space sure is
tight back there. The whole system is effectively one
piece but can be removed by removing the sway bar and un-
hooking the right side e-brake cable.





Discovered a broken transmission mount while changing the
starter (upgraded to one from an 00+ Sunfire 2.2L engine
which is smaller/lighter/faster). That's now the 4th
mount I've broken on this car :). Dog-bone twice, rear
trans mount bracket once (stock 4-speed metal bracket
into 3 pieces), and now this one.


Fortunately Rodney's poly mounts use readily available
poly bushings that only cost $20 to replace from Lordco.
It was changed relatively painlessly.

Other things that were changed include coilovers in the
rear using KYBs and 325# 12" springs, new shift cable
from California push-pull, Grant steering wheel, and a
new cold-air-intake using a K&N filter in front of the
wheel well.

Tuning has been improving as well. It now idles nicely
at 900-950 rpm and has a really nice lope. Here's a
video showing the new exhaust.
Cammed 3500 Fiero

Took it out for a quick spin after the video and although
the alignment is way off, it seems to handle much nicer
than before. Dampening is a bit soft for my liking but
is still firm enough for good performance.

I think before it goes back on the road it will be
getting some solid motor mounts. I'm just not satisfied
with the engine movement yet.

Edited by bcampbell
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 December 2013 at 1:33pm
Alright did up a couple solid mounts last night.

This one is on the front side of the engine, and uses
pieces of that shock-type mount that is used with the
stock 2.8. It bolts to two holes on the engine block and
one on the oil pan.


The other one I don't have a picture of but I just went
from the alternator bracket to what's left of the stock
dog-bone mount location on the trunk side. It's a little
tricky to install and less beefy but should compliment
the one on the front side and the dog-bone (which is
solid).
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2014 at 12:24am
Well after getting everything else sorted out, I guess it
was time to focus again on the engine. I had this
problem where every time I would run the engine (after
filling the coolant), air would get in the cooling system
and it would overheat. I thought for sure it was a head
gasket problem after doing a compression test and finding
one cylinder low, but this is what I found.



Head gaskets were both fine but the exhaust valves had
all been hitting the pistons. Cam is just too big for
the stock pistons I guess :). According to the machine
shop down the road the coolant issue is most likely being
caused by a cracked head.

Well, my pistons were already all dented so I decided to
go ahead and attempt cutting my own valve reliefs. I
finished one side of the block today and it was actually
pretty easy. Just put sandpaper on the bottom of the
valve, popped it in the head, bolted the head down with
two bolts, put the valve in a drill chuck, feeler gauge
between the valve seal and chuck to accurately notch the
pistons evenly, and drilled until the drill hit the seal.






Plan is to finish the other side of the block, put on a
new set of heads and see what happens :). If it goes
horribly wrong I'll most likely replace the engine and
put in a milder cam.
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 January 2014 at 8:30pm
BTW here is a pic of the decklid notch to clear the FWD
alternator. Very minor.

'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2014 at 10:57pm
Got the motor back together and it's running well. Turns
out that the overheating problem was most likely a
blockage or air lock, since after getting the motor back
together it was still wanting to overheat. Flushing the
system with a garden hose solved the problem.

Pulled the heads off of my Firebird (which blew the head
gaskets in October) to use on the Fiero and cleaned them
up:



And re-assembled the top end




Also installed a surge tank from a G6 to make filling the
coolant easier and put a 20 psi cap on the rad


And finally I test fit some STI RA seats


Startup
video
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Car-2-Lo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 February 2014 at 9:13pm
That's a nice wicked sound
Johnny-B-Good

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Patrick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 February 2014 at 9:37pm

Originally posted by bcampbell bcampbell wrote:

Well, my pistons were already all dented so I decided to go ahead and attempt cutting my own valve reliefs. I finished one side of the block today and it was actually pretty easy. Just put sandpaper on the bottom of the valve, popped it in the head, bolted the head down with two bolts, put the valve in a drill chuck, feeler gauge between the valve seal and chuck to accurately notch the pistons evenly, and drilled until the drill hit the seal.

I appreciate your ingenuity, but I still would've been afraid that different amounts of metal would've been removed from the top of the six pistons... putting the engine out of balance somewhat.

I guess the test will be to see how well the engine runs... and for how long.

Sounds good in your latest video clip.



Edited by Patrick
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Post Options Post Options   Quote bcampbell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 February 2014 at 8:00am
Well it was either notch the pistons myself, downgrade the cam, or get
a machine shop to do the work. Machine shop would have cost too
much so I chose option #1. Really I didn't take much material off, as the
pistons were aleady dented in those locations, and I would be surprised
if the balance is sufficiently off to cause issues, although it's a
possibility I had considered.

Before doing this I read about guys doing it on LS1s and Ford V8s so
after that I wasn't as nervous.

Worst case scenario I can get another engine for $300 and start over.
'86 2m6 F23 5-speed, LSD, 3.5L LX9
'89 Firebird 3500T, T56
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